Показания Оберхойзера, Трамзена, Зитца и фон Герффа
Короткий комментированный пересказ главных моментов
Заключение немецкой катынской комиссии основывалось на следующих трех главных комплексах доказательств: 1) документы, найденные у покойников, 2) судмедзкспертиза и 3) ботаническая экспертиза.
Позднейшие даты обнаруженных документов относились к весне 1940 г.
Время смерти устанавливалось по посмертным изменениям мозга по методу входившего в комиссию венгерского врача Орсоса - 3 года.
Такие выводы получила комиссия к предпоследнему дню своей работы 29 апреля 1940 г. Но, видимо, они показались недостаточными, и тогда, по всей видимости, у Орсоса, появилась идея в подкрепление провести также и ботаническую экспертизу.
Для ее проведения был вызван лесничий вермахта Фритц фон Герфф, занимавшийся в окрестностях примерно 60 км от Смоленска лесозаготовками для немецкой армии.
Во второй половине дня 30 апреля комиссия заседала в судебномедицинском отделе смоленской больницы. Оживленно дискутировались пункты заключения. В процессе спора председатель комиссии доктор Бутц распорядился принести микроскоп. Его спросили, зачем. Бутц ответил, что для проведения также и ботанической экспертизы. Румынский врач Биркле возразил: "Орсос, конечно, большой специалист в судебной медицине, но он берет на себя слишком много, претендуя на славу также и выдающегося ботаника". Один из участников комиссии поинтересовался, нет ли в группе армий Центр профессионального лесничего, которого можно было бы пригласить для проведения ботанической экспертизы. Бутц ответил утвердительно и прямо из комнаты, в которой происходило заседание, передал кому-то по телефону распоряжение прислать лесничего для выполнения экспертизы. Через несколько минут в комнату вошел лесничий вермахта Фритц фон Герфф.
По показаниям последнего на комиссии Мэддена, Бутц достал из чемодана два или три сосновых деревца, возраст которых очевидно составлял порядка 5-7 лет. Одно из них было разрезано, и фон Герфф рассмотрел разрез в микроскоп. Точный возраст он не запомнил, но отчетливо запомнил характерное затемнение у одного из годичных колец, что указывало на то, что три года назад в росте дерева произошла задержка, наиболее вероятной причиной которой была пересадка с одного места на другое, что потребовало стрессовой адаптации. Часть членов немецкой комиссии не удовлетворилась таким заключением и спросила его, а не могло ли затемнение быть вызвано не пересадкой, а, скажем, сильными перепадами температуры и т. п. причинами. Герфф им ответил, что и такой вывод категорически нельзя исключать.
На вопросы участников комиссии Мэддона, видел ли он ранее деревца непосредственно на могилах перед началом эксгумации, лесничий ответил отрицательно, пояснив, что ранее на том месте он бывал лишь однажды, 14 апреля, когда могилы были раскопаны, а раскопки к тому времени шли уже, как у него сложилось впечатление, не менее восьми дней, но не более двух недель.
Отсюда логически вытекают следующие выводы.
1. То, что деревца (всего в чемодане Бутца их было 2-3, а из них под микроскопом фон Герфф рассматривал срез только одного из них) были взяты с поверхности могил, устанавливается лишь на основании заявления Бутца, сделанного членам возглавлявшейся им комиссии. Притом участник этой комиссии датский доктор Трамзен вообще не припомнил, рассматривал ли лесничий срез под микроскопом, запомнил лишь факт присутствия лесничего на заседании и то, что Бутц заявил, будто бы специалист лесничий установил время пересадки деревьев.
2. Отсюда следуют два основных альтернативных предположения:
1) саженцы были пересажены 3 года назад непосредственно на поверхность могил (что констатировалось в заключении фон Герффа) или
2) деревца не пересаживались, выросли не на поверхности могил, а вообще на территории захоронения, перенеся 3 года назад, в 1940 г., сильную климатическую перегрузку (сильный перепад температуры и т. п.).
Кроме того, вполне допустима версия о том, что деревца для экспертизы были взяты вовсе не с мест захоронения в Козьих горах, а откуда-то совсем из другого места, причем было заведомо известно, что они пересаживались 3 года назад.
Главное, что заключение фон Герффа следует квалифицировать как более чем сомнительное.
Однако самый большой интерес представляет следующий пассаж в показаниях Зитца:
"Д-р Биркле часто критиковал открытия д-ра Орсоса, часто заявлял, что он слишком заходит и ведет себя слишком по-дикторски.
Мы обычно с юмором относились к этим перепалкам, поскольку считали, что вопросы четко снимались в былых различиях между районом Зинбурга и другими частями страны. Особенно это выражалось, когда возник вопрос об этих сосенках (Dr. Birkle frequently objected to the findings of Dr. Orsos, and frequently found them to be too far reaching or of a too dictatorial nature.
All of us frequently smiled at these bickerings, because it was our opinion that this was clearly manifested in former differences about Sienburgen
and other parts of the country. This was expressed particularly when the question of these fir trees arose)".
Что Зитц подразумевал под былыми отличиями Зинбурга от других районов страны, остается неясным. Однако имеет смысл разобраться в этом.
Ниже следует текст показаний.
TESTIMONY OF EUGEN OBERHAEUSEH[/center]
Mr. FLOOD. What is your full name?
General OBERHAEUSER. Eugen Oberhaeuser.
Mr. FLOOD. Were you, at one time, identified with the German armed forces?
General OBERHAEUSER. Yes, I was an officer of the permanent forces.
Mr. FLOOD. What was your rank and what was the nature of your command in 1041?
General OBERHAEUSER. I held the rank of lieutenant general and was the chief of communications of the central army group.
Mr. FLOOD. Could that be referred to and could your status be re¬ferred to as nacht richten commander of the army group?
General OBERHAEUSER. It could be called that. Our designation was chief of communications of the army group (Nachtfuehrer.)
Mr. MACHROWICZ. Well, when and why did you have to go and see the graves?
General OBERHAEUSER. Well, as I say, in view of the fact that my regimental staff was billeted right next to the graves and many people were busy digging there, I couldn't help passing right through this thing; and, of course, when I passed through, I also looked at these things and I couldn't help seeing that.
Mr. MACHROWICZ. Were you ever ordered to go there and see the graves and make a report on them?
General OBERHAEUSER. No.
Mr. MACHROWICZ. Were there any trees in the immediate vicinity of where the graves were found?
General OBERHAEUSER. In the spot where the graves were found there was sort of a clearing with tiny birch trees about 3 feet high — whether they had been planted there or not I do not know — and there was some heather on the ground, but, on the whole, it was a fairly clear sandy place, sort of a clearing.
Mr. MACHROWICZ. Now, these young saplings, or these young trees that you are talking about, were they right over the graves?
General OBERHAEUSER. I am not able to say whether these small birch trees were right on top of the graves because I only saw them after they had been opened, but the whole spot was covered with these small birch saplings, or birch trees, more or less.
Mr. MACHROWICZ. Did it appear to you then that someone, wdioever it was who dug these graves, after digging these graves, grew young sapling or birch sapling trees over them? Is that the impression you got?
General OBERHAEUSER. Afterwards I had the impression that prob¬ably these trees had been planted there for camouflage purposes.
Mr. MACHROWICZ. By "camouflage purposes" you mean by someone who wanted to conceal the location of the graves, is that what you mean ?
General OBERHAEUSER. Yes, exactly.
Mr. MACHROWICZ. And might not that have been the reason why these graves were not noticed by you or by the others in that vicinity sooner?
General OBERHAEUSER. Yes, that is quite correct. That is one of the reasons why we probably never noticed the spots where the graves were. And besides, similar fairly clear spots were also in other por¬tions of the forest, so this particular spot didn't distinguish itself much from the others.
Mr. MACHROWICZ. That is all.
Mr. DOXDERO. General, was the wood in the vicinity of the graves thick or thin?
General OBERHAEUSER. On the north side of the secondary road lead¬ing from the highway to the castle the forest was not very dense. On the other side of this road it was much denser.
Mr. DONDERO. Was that near the graves?
General OBERHAEUSER. The graves were on that side where the forest was not dense.
Mr. DONDERO. Would they be thick enough or dense enough so that a man could hide and see the shooting if the men were shot near the graves ?
General OBERHAEUSER. Single trees might have been there which were thick enough so that a man could have hidden and looked on, but the majority of the trees were rather thin.
Mr. DONDERO. Were they tall trees, or were they just a low height?
General OBERHAEUSER. The trees were fairly high, about 40 to 50 years old, pines; the size of trees about 40 to 50 years old, pine trees. I am no forester, I don't know very much about this.
Mr. DONDERO. Do you think, General, that a man, or two men, could have hidden in (hose pine trees that you have described, and near enough to the graves so they could have seen what was going on if the men were shot very close to where they were buried?
General OBERHAEUSER. Yes; in my opinion it would have been possible for one or two men to hide, because there were also single bushes standing about, so it would not have been impossible to hide there and look on.
Mr. DONDERO. Well, could they have hidden themselves by climb¬ing the trees so they could not have been seen ?
General OBERHAEUSER. I do not think that is very likely, because these pine trees, as usual, are quite bare, without branches.
TESTIMONY OF DE. HELGE TRAMSEN, COPENHAGEN, DENMARK
Mr. FLOOD. Doctor, it has been indicated to the committee by a number of witnesses of various kinds that trees of a certain height had been planted in the area, had been seen in the area, and had been removed from the grave just immediately prior to the grave being opened, of these Polish officers at Katyn.
Dr. TRAMSEN. Yes; I remember seeing quite a lot of lines of young fir trees about the height of one-and-a-half foot, and I saw them stretching out from the graves because they had been removed when those graves had been opened possibly.
Mr. FLOOD. Were any observations made or comments made by your colleagues or others there at the time with reference to those trees, anything of any special significance, that you recall?
Dr. TRAMSEN. Yes. But I do not understand much of forestry, and I have no special knowledge about. But the Germans produced a German specialist, a forester, who showed us these trees in cuts.
Mr. FLOOD. Do yon remember the name of the German forester?
Dr. TRAMSEN. Hafferer, or something like that. I don't quite remember the name, I am sorry.
Mr. FLOOD. If you heard the name, do you think you would recognize it?
Dr. TRAMSEN. Yes; I think so.
Mr. FLOOD. Could it have been Von Herff?
Dr. TRAMSEN. Yes; that is it.
Mr. FLOOD. What did von Herff say or do when you were there?
Dr. TRAMSEN. I cannot exactly remember that von Herff demonstrated the trees himself, but I can remember that Professor Buhtz gave a conclusion that the German forester had put up and stated on the examination of these trees.
TESTIMONY OF DR. WILHELM ZIETZ (THROUGH THE INTERPRETER
Mr. FLOOD. In 1943, what was your official title with the then German Government ?
Dr. ZIETZ. I was Deputy Chief of the Reich Public Health Service and Reich Physicians' Chamber with the Foreign Office.
On the last day at noon, still at Katyn, certain members of the delegation asked me what we now anticipated or expected from them as a result of it. They themselves suggested to me that it was most likely they would be of a unanimous opinion in regard to a protocol. This intimation did not start on the German side. As a matter of fact, it was made by the foreign, by the alien parties.
We met Professor Buhtz at the Institute of Forensic Medicine in the afternoon. With one exception, there were no Germans present but Professor Buhtz and myself. Professor Buhtz was requested to take charge of the negotiations, that is, more or less only of the technical side of the discussion, not of the contents. As to the contents, it was more or less performed by the spokesman of the committee, the senior member, Professor Orsos. It was, at any rate, a discussion between the foreign participants as to what should be contained in the protocol. There were no material discrepancies of opinion, it was more as to the form or as to the extent of the statements to be made.
For instance, I myself did not know this at Katyn, I mean, the question of the planting of trees. During that session, however, Professor Orsos requested a microscope. He produced out of a bag one of these saplings that Dr. Tramsen had mentioned before, and demonstrated, by the specimen, that these saplings had been replanted on one previous occasion and that, according to his findings, these saplings had been standing in one place for 3 years, and prior to that, for another 2 years, in a different place.
It was very interesting to notice, during that discussion as well as during all of the previous discussions, that all of the participants of the committee were unanimous as to a recognition of the international reputation of Dr. Orsos. But even in the course of this issue here there was a clear political difference between the Hungarian and the Rumanian. The Rumanian guest was a lecturer of the Institute of Forensic Medicine at Bucharest, which enjoyed a very good reputation. His name was Dr. Birkle. He emphasized, however, that he was no German but a full-blooded Rumanian. Dr. Birkle frequently objected to the findings of Dr. Orsos, and frequently found them to be too far reaching or of a too dictatorial nature.
All of us frequently smiled at these bickerings, because it was our opinion that this was clearly manifested in former differences about Sienburgen and other parts of the country *. This was expressed particularly when the question of these fir trees arose. Birkle said, in essence, as follows:
"Professor Orsos, you may be a really competent doctor of forensic medicine, and you might also be a very good artist, but that you, however, wish to be a very competent botanist, that is going too far."
Now, Professor Orsos demanded that his theory be adopted. I mean, the theory about the 3 and 2 years, respectively. Then one of the participants asked whether or not there was a forestry expert of the army group present, Professor Buhtz replied in the affirmative, and called up from the very same room that a forestry expert should report at once. He actually appeared within a few minutes, and he had no inkling as to what he was supposed to say. That was Mr. von Herff.
Now, Mr. von Herff took one look at the microscope, and, I wish to emphasize, right on the spur of the moment, without having been told before what the subject of the discussion was, said, "This tree here has been standing in one place for 3 years, here is a notch, and it has been standing in another place 2 years prior to that." That, at least, is what I remember.
After this clear-cut, expert statement of Mr. von Herff, Dr. Birkle admitted that he had been licked, and he furthermore admitted that Dr. Orsos was also a competent botanist.
TESTIMONY DF FRITZ VON HERFF, MICHELSTADT/ODENWALD, GERMANY (THROUGH INTERPRETER MOSTNI)
Chairman AIADDEN. Mr. von Herff, do you object to being photographed ?
Mr. VON HERFF. No.
Chairman AIADDEN. Just give the reporter your name and address, Mir. von Herff.
Mr. VON HERFF. Fritz von Herff; Alichelstadt/Odenwald; forester.
Mr. FLOOD. I direct your attention to the year of 1943 and ask you whether or not you were serving with the German armed forces on the Russian front in the Smolensk area?
Mr. VON HERFF. Yes, I did.
Mr. FLOOD. Were you serving in your capacity as a forester for the Armed Services in that area?
Mr. VON HERFF. Yes, I was.
Mr. FLOOD. Are you aware of the Katyn Forest and the massacre of the Polish officers in that area?
Mr. VON HERFF. I am pretty well familiar with the woods surrounding Katyn because I was extensively occupied in furnishing wood to German troops billeted around the area.
Mr. FLOOD. When did you first arrive in the Smolensk area?
Mr. VON HERFF. In the end of December 1941, I came to Smolensk.
Mr. FLOOD. When did you leave?
Mr. VON HERFF. On the 1st of August 1943.
Mr. FLOOD. In all the time you were in the area, did you have occasion to visit the area of the Katyn Forest in the vicinity of the Dnieper Castle?
Mr. von HERFF. Yes.
Mr. FLOOD. Did you have occasion, in your professional capacity as a forester, to observe carefully the nature of the terrain and the nature of the trees and growth within a thousand meters or more of the Dnieper Castle?
Mr. VON HERFF. According to my notes, I and my superior, a captain, inspected the Katyn graves on the 14th of April.
Mr. FLOOD. When was the first day that the graves were opened by the Germans in April of 1943, if you know?
Mr. VON HERFF. I don't know the exact date. It must have been eight or 14 days before.
Mr. FLOOD. During the time that you were in the Katyn Forest area, in December of 1941, until April 15, 1943, did you ever observe any extensive growths of small pine, evergreen, or birch trees?
Mr. VON HERFF. The entire region of Krasny Bor is a wooded area, the woods principally consisting of fir trees of various ages.
Mr. FLOOD. Is it possible for a forester of your experience, by observation, to be able to tell whether or not evergreen trees or birch trees have been transplanted within 3 years, if there had been any extensive transplanting in one area?
Mr. VON HERFF. That is not easy to say.
Mr. FLOOD. Is it easy to say one way or the other?
Mr. VON HERFF. No. It is impossible to say so definitely.
Mr. FLOOD. Certainly, in the length of time you were in the Katyn area, you examined the forests or the woods within a thousand meters of the Dnieper Castle; did you not?
Mr. VON HERFF. I was not around the castle much because that was the residence of the commander in chief and it was not so easy to gain access to the area.
Mr. FLOOD. Did you gain access and make any inspections or surveys for timber or lumber or fuel, or did you examine the woods and forest in the area?
Mr. VON HERFF. I did not survey any timber or lumber or wood of any kind in the area surrounding the graves. My area of operation was far away from Katyn, up to 60 kilometers from Katyn.
Mr. FLOOD. When was the matter of the Katyn graves first brought to your attention in your official capacity as a forester?
Mr. VON HERFF. On the 30th of April.
Mr. FLOOD. In what manner?
Mr. VON HERFF. I received a telephone call from the chief quartermaster telling me that I was supposed to proceed forthwith to a hospital in the eastern portion of Smolensk. There I was supposed to render an expert statement. The evening was approaching. I proceeded there, and there I found an international committee, about a dozen gentlemen. Presiding was General Surgeon Holm. General Holm presented to me several fir saplings — as has been mentioned by a previous witness — about 30 or 40 centimeters, one foot and a half in height. There might have been 2 or 3 pieces.
In the first place, I determined the age. To the best of my recollection, it was from about 5 to 7 years. Then I was asked whether the growing process had been a normal one. To this end, a crosscut of the sapling was made and I took a look at the crosscut under a microscope. There you could clearly see the year rings.
Every wooden plants adds every year one ring of wood, which is clearly discernible. How, it could be easily traced back that one of these yearly rings, 3 years ago, was of a very small size. This year, consequently, the growth of the plant must have been stunted.
Being foresters, we know that every plant, after being transplanted, does not grow normally the first year after the transplanting has been effected because the roots of the plant have to get accustomed to the new soil in which the plant grows. Therefore, I expressed my opinion that 3 years ago — that is, 3 years prior to 1943 — something must have happened to the plant.
Hence, when asked by the chairman whether a transplantation of a plant might have been done about 3 years ago, I replied in the affirmative.
The gentlemen of the committee were in full agreement but for a single party, who asked whether this stunted growth of the plant perhaps could be ascribed to inclement weather conditions, I right away admitted such a possibility.
That concluded my expert statement and I was asked no further questions.
Mr. FLOOD. Did you know where the tree came from that was shown to you by the scientist that night?
Mr. VON HERFF. No. I had not been told.
Mr. FLOOD. Did you know a Dr. Buhtz?
Mr. VON HERFF. I knew nothing of the gentleman.
Air. FLOOD. You did not talk to Dr. Buhtz on the phone or in person at any time prior to your visit to the scientist that night?
Mr. VON HERFF. I did not speak with any one of these gentlemen, either before or after this issue.
Mr. FLOOD. "What was the rank of the officer that talked to you and gave yon your orders to go to Smolensk?
Mr. VON HERFF. Well, I could not say; it was most likely an orderly officer who merely transmitted an order presumably given by the chief quartermaster.
Mr. FLOOD. How many rings were on the crosscut of the tree that you examined that night in Smolensk?
Mr. VON HERFF. As I said before, I don't remember quite accurately, but I indicated before, to the best of my recollection, the saplings were from 5 to 7 years of age.
Mr. FLOOD. If a sapling had seven rings on it, how old would it be?
Mr. VON HERFF. Seven years of age.
Mi*. FLOOD. Does it show a full ring for its first year of growth?
Mr. VON HERFF. That is merely intimated by a point — a dot.
Mr. FLOOD. Do you count the dot as one full year?
Mr. VON HERFF. One full year.
Mr. FLOOD. And you don't recall the exact number of rings in addition to the dot on the sapling you saw that night?
Mr. VON HERFF. No; I do not.
Mr. FLOOD. But you are positive it was not less than five?
Mr. VON HERFF. I am quite positive of that.
Mr. FLOOD. Was there any indication on the cross-cut sapling you saw of a darkening of the ring at the third ring?
Mr. VON HERFF. I do not remember any longer.
Mr. FLOOD. Did you ever see the graves at Katyn with trees the size that you are indicating you examined in Smolensk planted on the graves?
Mr. VON HERFF. Inasmuch as I visited the graves prior to having made this examination of the sapling, I didn't pay so much attention to the trees planted there. However, I recall that they are of approximately the same size as that sapling.
Mr. FLOOD. Did you visit the graves before they were opened?
Mr. VON HERFF. After they had been opened.
Mr. FLOOD. After they had been opened?
Mr. VON HERFF. Yes.
Mr. FLOOD. Did you see any trees lying around the area that you had been told had been removed from the top of the graves?
Mr. VON HERFF. No; I do not recall.
Mr. FLOOD. Had anybody discussed with you the existence of trees of the type and kind you examined at Smolensk as having been planted on the graves of the Polish officers?
Mr. VON HERFF. No; I know nothing about that.
Mr. FLOOD. Of course, at the time you went to the meeting of international scientists in Smolensk you had heard about the Katyn graves and they had been opened?
Mr. VON HERFF. Yes.
Mr. FLOOD. Weren't you curious or didn't you think in your mind what these scientists were doing there that you, as a forester, were called in to talk to them?
Mr. VON HERFF. Well, from the whole proceedings I was given to understand that I was supposed to help find out from the sapling I examined when these corpses had been buried.
Mr. FLOOD. The German side in this case takes the position, among others, in support of their conclusion that the Russians had perpetrated this massacre and, in order to conceal the graves in which the bodies were buried, took saplings 2 years of age, transplanted them on the graves, with the result that when the Germans, in April 1943, uncovered the graves, the saplings would then be 5 years of age. In your professional opinion as a forester, could the sapling or the two or three of them showed to you that night in Smolensk, especially the one you examined the cross-cut of. Have been such a sapling as could be 5 years of age and could have been transplanted 3 years previously to 1943?
Mr. VON HERFF. Definitely so. It might have been such a one, definitely.
Об эпидемии сыпного тифа в шталаге в Зинбурге в в конце 1941 г. и об уничтожении трупов умерших подробнее: Erlebnisse eines Nettetalers in Kriegsgefangenschaft
Von Günter Nonninger http://www.fdp-nettetal.de/index.php?id=40